the Sacrificial system

[anochria]

Olam- haba.

[John]

this is "the world to come" in hebrew. olam means unicerse or world. olamim is the plural of this word.

shalom- john

[Jonatan]

You mean sacrifices in the New Heaven and the New Earth?

[John]

yes. the Olam Haba is after the mellinium. the 1000 years is a transtition period btwn olam hazeh (the presnt world) and the olam haba, the world to come.

the mellinium may have sacrifices, but the olam haba is most likely being refered to by ezekiel

[Jonatan]

But, isn't it only in TEMPLE, mentioned by Ezekiel ?
In New Heaven and Earth there'll be no temple.

Revelation 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

[John]

i didnt ever see that verse. i dont know. i guess that means that the sacrifices in ezekiel must have been during the mellinium, and have no chance of being pat of the new earth. shalom- john

[anochria]

Or that the sacrifices in Ezekiel are symbolic of the living sacrifice of the church!

That passage in Revelation is describing something current that will be fully inaugurated after the return of Christ. And that something current is the fact that the only Temple there is now or that will ever be needed is Jesus and His church.

[John]

anochria. there are several things wrong with your theory that the sacrifices represent the living sacrifice of the church.

firstly, it contradicts the rule of thumb of peshat interpreation: take everything in its plain, literal sense unless it either CANNOT happen or it is given a symbolic meaning. other reasons include history proving that the expression was an idiom and such.

also, the sacrifice of the church is ONE living sacrifice. the sacrifices of Ezekiels temple are MANY sacrifices. also, there is mention of sin sacrifices, as i have recently realized. the church makes a sin sacrifice?

next, it derives itself from a false theology that Yirael has been replaced by the church in some way, or that it is the rue YIsrael.

there are other arguments, but i have to go eat with my family.

i will post later
shalom- john

[Jonatan]

I agree with John. Moreover, I cannot listen to such replacement theology doctrines. It should be submitted to Lord God with all repentance.

Although there ARE more levels of understanding the Scripture, none of them can contradict Peshat, otherwise it's from the spirit of Antichrist, against Jesus, against the Word of God. It is not that important on Yeshua how He look or looked like, or that He had to become a man. Not more important than the most important thing - which is - that HE IS THE WORD OF GOD. LITERAL WORD OF GOD.
If someone allegorize His Word, such person is spiritually doing the same as the gnostics (like band of Markion and others ...) who claimed that "Jesus hadn't physical flesh, but his presence among us was imaginary" - Apostle John Zabdee reacts on it in his letters by this:

2 This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God,
3 but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.
(1 John 4:2-3)

First catholic leaders made very antichrist work by allegorizing and that's why they are responsible for most heresies within RCC - namely: Origen, Augustin, Hieronymus, and some others.

The basis of replacement theology is to abolish the Law, by agile methods - allegorize the literal - fundamental meaning (or Peshat) - and replace it by something that says that the Peshat is now allegedly fulfilled by allegorized meaning.

Sacrifices in Ezekiel CAN HAVE SYMBOLIC MEANING FOR US AS THE CHURCH - can be Remez for us, but in no way for Israel. We, as a Church may be the spiritual post-image of Israel, but Israel is Israel by flesh forever and thus everything that is prophesied about Israel MUST be fulfilled IN FLESH, and for us as the Church fulfilled IN SPIRIT.

If anyone want to say that sacrifices in Ezekiel will be unliteral, that one is contradicting Yeshua, who said:

17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.
18 I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
19 Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
(Matthew 5:17-19)

Now, has He fulfilled it all at Golgotha, in the cross? Maybe spiritually YES, but literally NO WAY !!! Otherwise we would already been living in eternity.

[John]

yes, the sacrifices of Ezekiel may ave a remez- but probably a drash- interpetation that they repreesent the sacrifices of the church. however, this CANNOT contradict the plain sense that they are sacrifices.

the plain sense that they are sacriifces should be accepted unless they were written as an apparent allegory or parable. and these sacrifices were most definitely a literal thing for ezekile, a priest.

shalom- john

[pioneer]

Rev.21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
Yes Virginia there is a temple and there will be sacrifices. But as there will be no death, no blood sacrifices.
In Torah we rehearse, rehearse and rehearse agin! Only to not perform? Not!

If you want to sit on a cloud and play "Harpist" for eternity, go ahead, but for we who follow Torah we will continue to do the will of the Almighty, most likely his will in the olam habah will slightly different, as we all will be walking upright, walking in obedience.
According to my bible faithful workers will be rewarded with co-leadership with HIM. Somewhat like here on this earth, But as Yeshua said here on earth, Mt.22:30 For in the resurection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
Shalom
Shalom